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January 10, 2006
U.W. Outreach Building, Room 150
Casper, Wyoming
Senator Henry H.R. Hank Coe, Co-Chairman
Representative Jeff Wasserburger, Co-Chairman
Senator Kit Jennings
Senator Robert Peck
Senator Charles Townsend
Representative Patrick Goggles
Representative Debbie Hammons
Representative Steve Harshman
Representative Del McOmie
Representative Ross Diercks- Select Committee on School Finance
Senator Tex Boggs
Representative Kurt Bucholz
Representative Becket Hinckley
Representative Lorraine Quarberg
Representative Mark Semlek
Dave Nelson, School Finance Manager
Brenda Long, School Finance Analyst
Matthew Sackett, Associate Research Analyst
Joseph A. Rodriguez, Staff Attorney
Please refer to
Appendix 1 to review the Committee Sign-in Sheet
for a list of other individuals who attended the meeting.
Co-Chairman Coe called the public hearing to order at 8:35 a.m. The following sections summarize the Committee proceedings by topic. After brief opening remarks welcoming all of those in attendance Co-Chairman Coe deferred to Co-Chairman Wasserburger who echoed the welcoming remarks made by Co-Chairman Coe.
The following speakers testified before the committee in the following order. Please see Appendix 2 for a complete sign in sheet of those who wished to speak during the hearing. A brief synopsis of their testimony follows:
Speaker/Organization: Kirk Schmidt/Fremont County School District #1
Comments: Mr. Schmidt provided the committee with appendix #3. Mr. Schmidt indicated that this is the second time in ten years that the school funding model has been before the legislature. Mr. Schmidt claims that the business people from the Districts were not allowed to participate in the process the first time and they were not allowed to participate this time. The current block grant situation does not cover the actual situation being faced by the Districts. Specifically averaging principal salaries over all levels creates a serious disparity. Those salaries need to be broken out. In regard to health insurance the A&I information is not accurate in the sense that it does not accurately indicate who may join the program. Staffing needs to be calculated at 2000 hours. The purchase/services category is missing. That category accounted for 34.8 million dollars in spending in Wyoming last year. Mr. Schmidt indicated that they can and do tell the Department of Education where the block grant money is currently being spent.
Speaker/Organization: Don Dihle/Campbell County School District #1
Comments: Mr. Dihle provided the committee with appendix #'s 4,5,6,7. Mr. Dihle expressed his appreciation to everyone involved in the recalibration for all of their hard work. He believes that the activity spending in the model does not address the discrepancy between large schools and small schools. They have created a sliding scale for activity spending which they believe is cost based. See appendix #4. In regard to school food service, at the current time 47 out of 48 Districts supplement food service. Food service programs are usually supplemented by districts. He is offering a solution to this problem that will help smaller schools as it obviously is more expensive for smaller schools to provide food service. Their solution would cost approximately 2.2 million dollars. He thinks that food service needs to be in the model. Looking at the spreadsheet he provided the committee (appendix #7) the state experience factor is out of line for principals and business managers compared to teachers and other positions.
Speaker/Organization: Vern McAdams/Sublette County Schooled District #1
Comments: Mr. McAdams thanked the committee and the consultants for all of their hard work. He indicated that the model was very transparent and user friendly. He thinks that the weakness of the model is reliance on the research. National research does not equate to the realities of Wyoming. Wyoming is unique as a state. As a result of the last recalibration he ended up closing Albin High School. He urged the committee to continue looking at adjustments. He supports the approach by Mr. Dihle in regard to activities and staffing levels. He urged the committee to continue striving toward providing an exceptional not just an adequate education. He also does not think that anyone should lose money because of the regional cost of living adjustment. Overall he thinks the model has great potential.
Speaker/Organization: Margie Simineo/Superintendent Laramie County School District #2
Comments: Mrs. Simineo provided the committee with appendix #8. She stated that her district is slated to lose $ 357,000 in funding as a result of application of the new model. She said to correct the loss the committee and the consultants need to focus on a staffing error that impacts middle schools. Co-location of schools does affect funding where schools receive joint accreditation, see chart 1 in appendix 8. Co-location results in fewer teachers. She only wants to use ADM and to count co-located schools as two separate schools.
Speaker/Organization: Mary Lewis/Park County School District #16 Powell
Comments: She wants the model to remain as a funding mechanism for schools not as a dictate as to how to provide education. She supports maintaining local control. The model has potential to increase hours and does not provide enough money for salaries. M/O has seen a 45% increase in natural gas, need to make sure the ECA adjustment is available for utilities. Salary numbers should use 2005/2006 salary data. She continues to see errors in the model. She appreciates the use or the thought of the hedonic index as opposed to the WCLI.
Speaker/Organization: Pam Shea and George Rhodes/ Teton County School District
Comments: George Rhodes provided the committee with appendix #9. Mrs. Shea introduced George Rhodes, an economics professor from Colorado State University. Rhodes began his discussion regarding the regional cost adjustment. He claims that the hedonic index is arbitrary and outside of the mandate of Campbell II as amenity variables are not allowed. Obviously the index used must be cost based and Campbell II mandates adjustment for more expensive districts. Mr. Rhodes' proposal is to adjust teacher pay in Districts where the cost of living is greater and do not adjust in Districts that are below the Wyoming Cost of Living Index (WCLI). Proposes district by district use of the WCLI inflationary rate. He stated that adjusting down is inadequate as all districts still have to pay market salaries.
Speaker/Organization: Bob Lewandowski, Tracy Thomas, Tracy Rerner and Travis Duncun/ Park County School District #16, Meteetse
Comments: Mr Lewandowski - Meteetse has 141 K-12 students. This session was billed as "take your shot" so that is what he is going to do. They are currently in a state of desperation. They are operating at a deficit of $355,000.00. Under the proposed model and after recalibration they will be operating at a deficit of $118,000.00. He understands the problem with the model regarding co-located schools but does not think that it is just a glitch. His school will continue to operate at a deficit if that is what it takes because that is what is best for the students. The other speakers essentially confirmed the information presented by Mr. Lewandowski.
Speaker/Organization: Rick Luchsinger/Niobrara School District #1 Lusk
Comments: Mr. Luchsinger provided the committee with appendix #10. He discussed teacher allocation in small districts. There is a problem with communication, they assumed that secondary schools were high schools. Every district should have or at least be given credit for an elementary school, a middle school and a high school. He thinks salaries should start at the current average of $43,000. He likes the approach taken by George Rhodes regarding external adjustments and the earlier proposal regarding activities.
Speaker/Organization: John Baule/Sheridan County School District #3, Arvada-Clearmont
Comments: Provided the committee with appendix #11. Mr. Baule indicated that in his district they have lots of small schools with a lot of mileage in between them. Under the proposed funding model their grant would be reduced by $262,000.00 or about 10% of their allocation. He claims that the model does not provide adequate numbers of teachers and for his district a number of teachers live outside of the district because there is no housing.
Speaker/Organization: Mary Houck/Natrona County School District
Comments: Provided the committee with appendix #12. She is a teacher and is appearing before the committee in support of the instructional coaches in the model. In her district instructional coaches support about 10 schools, with about 52 teachers. She also teaches 3 times a week. Instructional coaches plan curriculum and specific strategies, they research and write grants. Teachers are allowed, with the extra time, to use "pre" and "post" assessments to drive the results of their students.
Speaker/Organization: Leslie Madden/Natrona County School District
Comments: Mrs. Madden provided the committee with appendix 13. She is speaking on behalf of the reading first program and instructional coaches. Mrs. Madden discussed how the instructional coaches help the faculty with the reading first program.
Speaker/Organization: Verba Echols and Stephanie Shafer/Natrona County School District #1
Comments: They provided the committee with appendix #14 and urged the committee to move forward on the salary issue. They claim higher salaries will aid the districts in recruiting quality teachers.
Speaker/Organization: Al Keeler/Natrona County School District #1
Comments: Mr. Keeler was speaking to the committee in support of the model as it pertains to instructional coaches.
Speaker/Organization: Gary McDowell/Wyoming Education Association
Comments: Provided the committee with appendix #15 and appendix #16. Mr. McDowell applauds all of the work that has been put in regarding the model. He applauds full day kindergarten and the improvement of transparency in the new model. He questions whether the model accurately identifies all components. Staffing for specialist teachers needs to be at 33% not 20%. Class size is very important and urges the committee to maintain small classes. Salary levels are inaccurate and recommended the committee move to the national average salary of $47,808.00. This figure will play a key role in the districts ability to recruit and retain quality teachers. He would like to see the committee raise all other salaries as well. The WEA supports the increase of 5 extra days saying it will have a significant impact regarding at risk students. He is concerned about the regional cost adjustment. On the external cost adjustment, he suggests use the WCLI and looking at pulling health insurance and utilities from the WCLI. He supports the activities proposal by Campbell County School District #1 and feels that overall the quality of education in Wyoming has improved.
Speaker/Organization: Dave Treick/Park County School District #6
Comments: Provided the committee with appendix #17. Mr Treick was speaking on salaries and how salaries affect the hiring of teachers, recruitment of teachers and the retention of teachers. The new model allows the Districts to add staff but they will also lose staff in the future due to retirements. Worried that salaries will not be competitive. The teachers are saying "show me the money".
Speaker/Organization: Tom Cook/Park County School District #6
Comments: Wanted to discuss the cost of housing and its effect on the recruitment and retention of teachers. Housing in Cody is expensive. His son looked at going into education so he has studied all aspects of the market. Claims that the salaries in the model are not accurate.
Speaker/Organization: Jean Peterson/Park County School District #6
Comments: She provided insight on salaries. Park County # 6 still had a deficit last year because of an increase in classified salaries. Teachers cannot afford to stay in Cody.
Speaker/Organization: Mark Higdon/Wyoming School Boards Association
Comment: He provided the committee with appendix #18. Mr Higdon has an issue with people who did salary research for Picus and Odden. The model is very positive major focus seems to be on helping the children. Children do not benefit from large class sizes. His major concern with the model is teacher salaries would like to see a salary schedule with a base and an upper end. Suggested a beginning salary of between $33,000 to $35,000. Superintendent salaries need different increments. Health insurance need to stay with local districts and would like to see 33% specialist teacher staffing levels.
Speaker/Organization: Jennifer Grooms/Natrona County School District #1
Comments: Provided the committee with appendix #19. Instructional coaching, they have researched it and tried it. Good coaching validates good teachers.
Speaker/Organization: Brian Recht/ Albany County School District #1
Comments: Urges the committee to give consideration to Rhodes ECU solution. He does not support use of the hedonic. Consider 33% for specialist teachers which keeps students involved and keeps them in school. Wants to increase money to the arts provide the full basket of educational goods.
Speaker/Organization: Rob Young Teacher/Albany County School District #1
Comments: He is a teacher in Centennial, Wyoming. Urges higher salaries for teachers. He moved here in 1979 for the money. Started out in Hanna. Salaries have to be far greater than surrounding states, cannot be "just competitive." Also worried that UW may not be able to supply enough teachers.
Speaker/Organization: Sue Bellish/Sheridan County School District #1
Comments: She is in a district not fitting any prototypical models. Her district has about 900 kids. They have no real electives and would lose about 15 positions under this model. The committee did a great job and now approaching the home stretch. She supports Teton Counties use of WCLI and the proposals by Campbell County regarding activities and food service. She likes the use of instructional facilitators and urges support of the gifted and talented programs at 100%.
Speaker/Organization: Jim Lowham/Natrona County School District #1
Comments: Provided the committee with appendix #20. Encouraged better research and to fund the model as the consultants suggest. The proposed model accurately requires reporting to the Department of Education. He says this is healthy for all. He does urge caution in the best practices are needed and they change quickly and it may take time to mold districts to the model. The model needs to offer competitive salaries.
Speaker/Organization: Arlene Steward/Natrona County School District #1
Comments: Provided the committee with appendix #21. Self funded health insurance. They are using excess funds to pay for comprehensive health insurance with wellness and preventative programs. By doing health insurance themselves employee have taken a larger role in wellness. Want to continue with local plan funded inside the model essentially give us the money and they will provide insurance.
Speaker/Organization: Syd Webb/Natrona County School District #1
Comments: Provided the committee with appendix #22. She is the wellness coordinator in the district. Employees are taking responsibility for themselves by educating them on health care consumption and addressing personal health and wellness.
Speaker/Organization: Michael Bond/Natrona County School District #1
Comments: Mr. Bond provided the committee with appendix #23. His school has counselors, tutors and librarians. They also have excellent teachers. They use title one benefits to fund many of the components that are funded under the model. In regard to instructional coaches, the shared leadership helps all students learn. Coaches serve as leaders.
Speaker/Organization: Peggy Sanders/Carbon County School District
Comments: She stated that the model was workable. She is a little concerned about salaries and would like the salary component to be increased.
Additional Material provided the committee.
Although not associated with any specific speaker, appendices #24 and #25 were provided to the committee and are made a part of the record.
There being no further business, Co-Chairman Wasserburger closed the Public Hearing and adjourned the meeting at 3:20 p.m..